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The Rediff Interview/ Gurudas Kamat

Gurudas Kamat, member of the just dissolved Lok Sabha, appears to have broken away from his mentor, Sharad Pawar, after this week's rebellion.

In conversations with Onkar Singh, and Archana Masih Kamat revealed that the majority of MPs from Maharashtra are with Sonia Gandhi, and not Pawar. In

He also disclosed that Pawar had discussed the issue of Sonia's origin and whether a person of foreign origin should become prime minister of India with MPs from the state a fortnight before he wrote the controversial letter to the Congress president along with P A Sangma and Tariq Anwar.

Maharashtra has been a strong base of the Congress party. Were you taken aback when Sharad Pawar wrote this letter to the Congress president?

You are right when you say that Maharashtra has been a strong base for the Congress party. It is unfortunate that Mr Pawar has chosen this time to raise this issue in his letter to Congress President Mrs Sonia Gandhi. We are shocked that he wrote such a letter because he has been campaigning and justifying Mrs Gandhi's presence in Indian politics.

If you recall the events which have taken place since the last general election, you would find he was one of those Congress leaders who took the initiative in asking Mrs Gandhi to take over the role of Congress president and lead the party in the hour of crisis. We were very proud of the fact that he had taken the lead then.

It is all the more surprising that having gone all over Maharashtra and other parts of the country justifying her entry into politics and telling the people of India how good a daughter-in-law she has been, how good a citizen she has been, how good a Congress president she has been and how she is the only person fit enough to become the prime minister, he should now say that only a person of Indian origin should become the prime minister of India. We are really surprised that the issue has been raised at such a juncture.

What do you think is the provocation for him to have raised this issue now?

We really don't know why he has done this. This is not the real issue he is trying to raise. There may be many other things behind this. May be he felt slighted in the past. May be he felt sidelined. Maybe he felt he was not getting enough importance. Because he could not raise those issues, that's why he chosen to raise this issue.

He had discussed this issue with us and we spoke our mind to him. We told him this was no issue. It was a baseless allegation. This issue came up for discussion in the last Lok Sabha election and the people of India have already given their verdict on it.

When did he discuss the issue with you?

He had discussed this issue with me and a few other colleagues a fortnight before he wrote this letter. We had told him it is pointless to discuss this subject. In fact, it is wrong to mention it as well. If he had any other grouse this is not the way to go about it. We had told him in so many words.

How much damage has been done to the Congress because of this?

I don't know. We Congressmen have always supported the Gandhi family in Maharashtra. We are proud of the fact that Sonia Gandhi is the Congress president. She has chosen to resign and we are determined not to let her go. She has to take back her resignation. But it is a big fight now.

We would have trounced the BJP-Shiv Sena alliance in Maharashtra but if Pawar chooses to quit the party, I am very careful in using the term, then we would have a big fight.

Why has no action been taken against him and the others who raised a banner of revolt against the Congress leadership?

I think it is a very wise move. We should not try and provoke him and the others. He had done the right thing by writing a letter to the Congress president because we are a democratic party. But it is important to find out who leaked the letter to the press? Action needs to be taken against the person who leaked the letter before it reached the Congress president. I think in a day or two action will be taken. No action was taken earlier because the leadership was trying to find out who leaked the letter.

Why did Sangma join this bandwagon?

We are as shocked as you are. He had been given such important assignments by Mrs Gandhi. In fact, both Pawar and Sangma had addressed a big rally in my constituency along with Rajesh Pilot and others only a couple of weeks ago. They both praised Mrs Gandhi and it was least expected that they would be doing this.

You met her after she tendered her resignation as the Congress president. What did she say? Are you thinking of an alternative solution to run the party?

We have offered our resignation from various posts. AICC office bearers have tendered their resignations from their posts. There is no need for an alternative arrangement because we are sure she could come back to the party.

Will she campaign for the Congress party?

She has said she will continue to remain in the party and that is a good sign. We hope she will campaign for the party just as she did in the last general election.

Will the Congress emerge from this crisis before the election?

Luckily, we have enough time to sort out this issue once and for all.

How is this move going to affect Pawar's political future? Do you think it may be harmful for him?

I believe it will jeopardise his political career. Historically whosoever has ditched the Congress party has not survived or flourished. Sooner or later they have returned to its fold. There is a growing feeling in the party that he and the others are on their way out. Now he has taken the foreigner issue outside the party to the people. This is political suicide.

What action is the CWC likely to take against these leaders?

The CWC has taken note of of their grouse. It has refused to subscribe to their view. No action was taken then because it was an intra party affair. Since Pawar has now taken this matter outside, he has transgressed party lines and is liable to disciplinary action.

You appear confident about their expulsion?

I am convinced. Unless they resign. We have to see who gives in first!

You expect Pawar to announce his decision on his own turf in Maharashtra?

Oh yes, he will remain in the Pune-Baramati region. That is his home base. He is delivering a lecture in Pune on May 20. We are expecting a significant announcement from him then.

So there is every likelihood that Sharad Pawar will announce the formation of a new alliance then?

We have been receiving information that he is talking to several parties, seeking support from them. Let us see what comes out of it.

There are rumours that he is looking towards Chandra Shekhar and Mulayam Singh Yadav for support.

He could be. Chandra Shekhar is an old friend. He is also a one man party. Neither can benefit each other. I don't see Mulayam Singh Yadav will go Pawar's way. Both Yadav and Amar Singh have been critical of Pawar's handling of TADA detenues in Maharashtra when he was CM. Moreover, Mulayam claims Bombay as his constituency, though we don't subscribe to this outlook of Mulayam's. I don't see him supporting Pawar.

Doesn't Pawar run the risk of getting marginalised in national politics by his move?

Yes, he faces that risk. I was confident he had a very bright future in the Congress. Sonia Gandhi had given him the most crucial role in the party recently -- the most important assignment of striking electoral alliances. Finally, it appeared as though he had won the complete trust of Sonia Gandhi. She was observing his potential. But now, all this has been undone. This is total misjudgment on his part.

In spite of being such a senior leader why has Pawar not been able to establish a sound support base within the party? He has tried to bid for PM and the Congress president's post before and failed. Why has he been unsuccessful in his attempts?

Even we have wondered about this and have repeatedly lobbied for him within the party. We insisted he should attain a national profile, but he, on the other hand has concentrated on Maharashtra. This has been frustrating for us. He was not working hard enough because he could not win the confidence of workers from other states. They have not found him accessible. He is an ideal political strategist, good organiser, but this action will cost him too much.

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